By jcavell on

Hi

I am fairly new to Drupal, and admit I'm struggling (who doesn't?) to work it out.

I've installed the Category module, but I'm having this problem:

1. I create a menu
2. I assign that menu in a block to the left hand side
3. I create content (container). As the parent I leave as . In "menu settings" I give it a title and I set parent item to my newly created menu.

What I find is that this container appears in a completely different menu, and not with the "menu settings" title, but with the container title. I've tried this 3 times, tried deleting the menu and starting again, and each time I get the same result - it is set to a different menu than the one I choose. Is it me, or is there a bug in the Category module?

Thanks

Jonny

⋅ Categories: Drupal 4.7.x

Comments

venkat-rk’s picture

venkat-rk commented

1.) Do you mean a menu or a menu item (link)?
2.) Didn't quite get what you meant by "As the parent I leave as".

One of the reasons the container is moved to a different menu may be because you are overriding the title that is automatically set for each container (the container name itself).

Also be aware that the menu tree generated by category module is database driven although it relies on the underlying core menu system in drupal.

jcavell’s picture

jcavell commented

1) I mean a menu
2) When creating a container, in "container information", in the Parent: select list, I leave it set as root

Once the container is submitted, I cannot change the "menu settings" parent item to anything other than the one it has mysteriously been set to. E.g. changing it to 'Navigation' doesn't work.

Because I'm new, I could be going about things the wrong way. I'm trying to create containers and categories (in a tree structure) and attach them to menus to create navigation for the user. Is this a good way to do it?

Interestingly, if I delete that menu which has had categories assigned to it, the categories then get assigned to 'Navigation' instead (why?). This is all very strange behaviour - surely it should not be happening this way?

Thanks

Jonny

jcavell’s picture

jcavell commented

I have noticed that if I go to admin/settings/category and in "menu item settings" I change the default menu to the one I want, then when I create a category it gets assigned to that menu.

jcavell’s picture

jcavell commented

The main problem with this module (apart from the possible bugs) is the user interface.

When I create a category, I have the choice of changing:
"category information" -> container
"category information" -> Parent
"categories" - a list of categoriers from who knows where?
"Menu settings" -> Parent Item

No real explanation about what each of these means. The usability here is extremely poor.

When creating a news story, I get a choice of categories to assign to - a seemingly random subset of ones I've created in the past. However, some of these I can't de-select, and the story gets assigned to multiple categories, and ends up in the wrong place.

All in all, it might have been done out of the goodness of somebody's heart, but it's a royal pain in the butt to use. I'm getting fed up hearing the excuse "because it's powerful it's complex, and because it's complex it's difficult to use". You can have complexity and ease of use, if you follow a few guidelines.

venkat-rk’s picture

venkat-rk commented

I can really understand your pain, but I think you are jumping to conclusions rather too quickly about the module. I am not saying this just because I am a strong advocate of this module. Sure, it has issues and bugs like any other module, but the module developer is extremely responsive and it is far superior to the core taxonomy module in its ability (among other things) to help with both categorisation (which taxonomy does well) **and** structure (which taxonomy does poorly, if at all, unless you use half a dozen helper modules).

Unfortunately, I don't have time at the moment to give you a detailed answer, but I want to emphasise that there is no need for you to create the menu items manually- the module creates it automatically and then you can visit administer>>menu and move the menu links you want into a menu block of your own. Be aware that when you do this, though, you will lose breadcrumbs, but if you have enabled ToC in category_display and have weighted your containers in the order in which you want the menu items to appear in the menu block, you will always have the correct prev/sequence in the ToC to make up for the breadcrumbs.

According to Jaza, most of the menu issues related to the category module are essentially because of the deficiencies of the underlying core menu system. I have no reason to disbelieve him.

Do read up the stuff on http://category.greenash.net.au/ and enjoy this brilliant module and its brilliant implementation. The taxonomy wrapper module alone makes category worth its weight in gold...Just focus on creating the containers and categories and leave the menus to the module and move them around later into blocks.

jcavell’s picture

jcavell commented

...but why on the Administer Categories page does it actually list Containers rather than categories?

And again, when I'm creating a story, and choose the "menu settings" Parent Item, this is being ignored and set to something seemingly random. Why is this? Is it a bug in the module? Or from somewhere else in Drupal?

It might be a good module in many ways, but if I can't use it then what use is it?

Thanks

Jonny

Heine’s picture

Heine commented

It might be a good module in many ways, but if I can't use it then what use is it?

Apparantly, a few others are using the module, so I guess it has some use. If you believe there's a bug in the module, or want to request a feature (eg. different UI), file an issue against Category.
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jcavell’s picture

jcavell commented

The problem is that (partly because I'm new) I'm not sure if it is an issue or if I'm doing something stupid.

My latest problem is that when I create a story, again it's getting assigned to the wrong menu, and when I alter it (can only be done in "edit the advanced settings"), the links at the top of the story are wrong. Not only this, but the story's parent category does not contain the story on its page (although it appears correctly in the menu).

It looks like a great module - otherwise I'd have given up long ago! But looking at the issue list for the Category module, there are so many active that I'm wondering whether it is really ready to use yet?

venkat-rk’s picture

venkat-rk commented

There is at least one popular site that is currently using category module and plenty of others not announced including my own.

I will try and find some time to look at the problems you have mentioned. Some quick answers, though:

...but why on the Administer Categories page does it actually list Containers rather than categories?

The default view on that page is the list view- it is just an overview of all the containers. The last link for each container listing is to the categories of that container. Alternatively, you can click on the outline link to view the container with all its categories.

And again, when I'm creating a story, and choose the "menu settings" Parent Item, this is being ignored and set to something seemingly random. Why is this? Is it a bug in the module? Or from somewhere else in Drupal?

I really don't understand why you are going to this extra trouble. Save this labour and simply let category module create the menu items and then move it into blocks from administer>>menu. Additionally, if you set the container settings to have menu items automatically created, you don't have to worry about manually choosing the menu settings each time.

Not only this, but the story's parent category does not contain the story on its page (although it appears correctly in the menu).

Set the depth of the container that has your story's parent category to -1 to list *all* stories tagged with categories in that container.

jcavell’s picture

jcavell commented

I really don't understand why you are going to this extra trouble. Save this labour and simply let category module create the menu items and then move it into blocks from administer>>menu

Note quite sure what you mean here - are you saying after I create my container, instead of using "menu settings", I should go to Administer>>menu and add it as a menu item here? Why is this better?

Thanks

venkat-rk’s picture

venkat-rk commented

Hi, what I meant is that when you create a container, a menu link is automatically created for it and for any categories you create under that container in the navigation menu. You can then move these menu links around into blocks etc at administer>>menus

If you are not seeing 'category menu settings' on your container creation form, just check if you enabled the category_menu module on the admin>>modules page. By default, menu items in a container are enabled. Another reason you may not be seeing the menu links is if your container is hidden and the menu items are disabled.

Folkert’s picture

Folkert commented

That's not what he meant, at last my understanding is different.
He says simply leave it alone (the menu part) because it will be covert by the module and pathauto (i assume you have category_menu and category_pathauto running)

jcavell’s picture

jcavell commented

OK, but I need to assign my container to a menu first, right? After I create the container, if I set Menu items for assigned nodes to enabled, I don't need to bother messing with adding things in the "menu settings" area for child nodes. Is this what you mean? I understand that, but some points follow:

  • It is extremely confusing having menu settings which shouldn't be used, and in fact don't work - should there be some warning in this area? (or is it impossible, because stories don't know anything about the category module? I'm new!)
  • Does it mean that e.g. for a story I can't now have a different menu title from title on the story page?
  • If I do update (in advanced settings - the only place where it works) the menu settings parent item, and I have Menu items for assigned nodes set to enabled, I get the duplication of menu items - one with the story's title and one with the menu settings title. Surely it shouldn't work this way?

I'm not sure what pathauto is, having a look now..

Thanks

venkat-rk’s picture

venkat-rk commented

OK, but I need to assign my container to a menu first, right?

No!

By default, all containers are automatically assigned to your site's root menu- the one called 'Navigation'. Of course, you can move it to something different- say, primary links- or to some other menu you define yourself.

If you are particular about having menu navigation blocks, simply concentrate on creating the containers and categories first. Then, vist administer>>menu, create a menu and click on the edit link for your category or container and make your new menu the parent. Then, go to administer>>blocks and enable the blocks.

After I create the container, if I set Menu items for assigned nodes to enabled, I don't need to bother messing with adding things in the "menu settings" area for child nodes. Is this what you mean?

Yes. But, think carefully whether you want the node links to appear in the menu. They can make things look quite messy.

It is extremely confusing having menu settings which shouldn't be used, and in fact don't work - should there be some warning in this area?

Jaza mentioned a couple of links yesterday. You can look them up in one of the issue for category module. In sum, he suggested some changes to core drupal to override this default presentation, but those patches have not been accepted yet. So, this isn't the category module's problem, but with something in the base drupal system that might yet be changed.

or is it impossible, because stories don't know anything about the category module?

I am sure you would have learned by now that you enable content types for specific containers to associate them with those containers. This is how you ensure that stories get to know about the category module

Does it mean that e.g. for a story I can't now have a different menu title from title on the story page

Yes. Is there a particular reason why you want different titles?

jcavell’s picture

jcavell commented

Thanks for your reply.

The main reason I would want a different title would be that I might want a short version for the menu, but a more informative one on the story itself.

But I'm having so many problems with the Category module that I think it's time I called it a day and moved to the taxonomy and book modules instead (I've never used these, and hear what you say about them, but hopefully they'll work). I don't doubt that the Category module's got good functionality. But its user interface is so dreadful that I don't think it's ready to use yet - not for me, anyway.

venkat-rk’s picture

venkat-rk commented

The main reason I would want a different title would be that I might want a short version for the menu, but a more informative one on the story itself

May be you should submit a feature request against the category module. It already has the facility to specify an admin title for a container that is different from the actual title, so it may not be impossible to implement your request.

I agree that if you find it difficult to use, you should consider other options.

PMunn’s picture

PMunn commented

I'm also seeing this problem.

Here is the category module page on drupal.org.

This has been written about in other issues. The module author has noted that you can't use "Menu Settings" anymore once you're using the category_menu module, and he needed patches to core which have been thus far ignored to allow a module to disable access to the Menu Settings section.

It might be do-able elsewhere, but the way I've seen email items work is:
administer -> categories -> edit container link -> Menu Settings -> "edit the advanced menu settings" for this item link.

Change the menu settings there and it'll stick. Change it outside of that advanced page and it won't stick.

venkat-rk’s picture

venkat-rk commented

It might be do-able elsewhere, but the way I've seen email items work is:
administer -> categories -> edit container link -> Menu Settings -> "edit the advanced menu settings" for this item link.

Change the menu settings there and it'll stick. Change it outside of that advanced page and it won't stick.

You are right about this. Another place where you can change the menu title is by going to ..admin/menu and editing the category or container to change the title. This will stick, but will be gone the moment you edit the container and make changes.

Reading the original post again, I think the author wanted to do two things:

1.) Change the title of a menu link. This can be done as above
2.) Have a custom menu: this might help- http://drupal.org/node/89119#comment-163106