The usage of bullets in pages like /admin/structure and /admin/configuration cause significant performance issues in terms of reading, they where introduced at first as preceding to any list item. However I am more and more starting to dislike the effect this has on scanning pages like this, because the flow of reading is constantly interrupted by an indent that doesn't allow the eye to look straight down the category heading, also it distracts as its constantly in the periferal vision.
Mark Boulton has a very interesting article on this topic, http://www.markboulton.co.uk/journal/comments/five-simple-steps-to-bette... - how indented bullets tend to disrupt the flow of reading. In our case its even more serious as we basically have 19 bullets on /admin/configuration that are not used for orientation but rather distract.
I have discussed this with Mark and he agreed we needed to remove this.
Comment | File | Size | Author |
---|---|---|---|
#16 | admin-list-bullets_924956.patch | 708 bytes | Jeff Burnz |
#8 | 924956.patch | 906 bytes | swentel |
#3 | 924956.patch | 917 bytes | swentel |
#1 | configuration-compact-cropped.png | 120.16 KB | Bojhan |
configuration-compact.jpg | 216.07 KB | Bojhan |
Comments
Comment #1
Bojhan CreditAttribution: Bojhan commentedComment #2
Bojhan CreditAttribution: Bojhan commentedComment #3
swentel CreditAttribution: swentel commentedComment #4
mfer CreditAttribution: mfer commentedWhile I cannot speak to the UX element the code works as expected all the way back through ie6.
Comment #5
jbrown CreditAttribution: jbrown commentedSee also #202593: 'Hide descriptions' link on admin/config affects other pages.
Comment #6
Bojhan CreditAttribution: Bojhan commentedNot really related at all. We are not dropping the feature.
Comment #7
sunShould be shortened into
0.25em 0
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Comment #8
swentel CreditAttribution: swentel commentedComment in #7 applied.
Comment #9
Bojhan CreditAttribution: Bojhan commentedBack to RTOTHEBC
Comment #10
Dries CreditAttribution: Dries commentedUsing bullets reduces reading performance is a weird statement. Weren't bullets invented to help improve reading?
Comment #11
sunSounds like D8 material to me.
Comment #12
Bojhan CreditAttribution: Bojhan commentedThis is definitely not D8 material.
@Dries Yes, they where - however in this case they instead are distracting. They are primarily to be used in paragraphs of text, whenever they are used for menu's there performance is very limited (especially at this mass). I will ask mark boulton to comment, as this is a fairly difficult optimization to understand.
Comment #13
markboulton CreditAttribution: markboulton commentedUsing bullets in the flow of text increasing reading performance as they are designed to act as visual representations of pauses in speech, or gesticulation. But, stand-alone, especially in this context, they don't add anything to the legibility of the type and should be removed.
One thing to be mindful of, however, is if any of the items in the list drop onto a second line. You need to make sure the line-height is such that the second line does not appear like another item in the list.
Comment #14
Jeff Burnz CreditAttribution: Jeff Burnz commentedI agree the bullets are distracting in this context, however we need to mindful that we need to deliver D7 - therefore its difficult to endorse UI changes unless they are at least major bugs. This seems more of a design tweak.
Also we need to account for #13 "if any of the items in the list drop onto a second line...", we can achieve this by setting line-height to 1 (Unitless), change the LI margin to 0 0 0.75em; and add some margin-top to the UL (maybe 8px).
While it might appear items dropping to a second line is unlikely, they certainly can, in the case where the user may increase the font-size to a very large size and use a low resolution screen (800x600 for example) in which case Case and hover style are the only indicators.
Comment #15
Bojhan CreditAttribution: Bojhan commented@jeff Can you supply a patch?
Comment #16
Jeff Burnz CreditAttribution: Jeff Burnz commentedUpdated patch, to test set the browser to 800x600 and push the text size up as far as you can (you might want to hide or disable toolbar when doing this).
Note that this patch will also remove bullets from admin/structure list, I am not sure if that is wanted also?
Comment #17
Cliff CreditAttribution: Cliff commentedWith all due respect for Mark Boulton — and he is right, in this case it's easier to skim the titles without bullets — this is fine tuning. If it's easy, do it. But if it's taking any resources at all away from getting D7 out the door, save it for the next release. Aren't there critical issues to fix?
Comment #18
Cliff CreditAttribution: Cliff commentedIn fact, now that I've read @webchick's comment here, I wonder: Will this affect screenshots already produced for books in the works? Maybe we do need to hold off on this issue for a bit. Think it over.
Comment #19
Jeff Burnz CreditAttribution: Jeff Burnz commentedWell, if it doesnt make it to 7.x-1.x then it could slip in later on. Either way I am not fussed, the bullets I am used to, but that's only me, I really do think its better without them, however it does render the admin/structure page even more naked that it was before, which was pretty naked and IMO weirdly inconsistent with other admin lists.
Comment #20
moshe weitzman CreditAttribution: moshe weitzman commentedjeez guys. this is an improvement. lets commit it, instead of wringing hands over a screenshot somewhere that might have bullets in it. folks can re-take screenshots. we have a live audience of thousand and thousands that merit consideration too.
Comment #21
Bojhan CreditAttribution: Bojhan commentedFrom structure is good too, I think - especially if you start having more items, the bullets don't work as well.
@Cliff Lets not get to over worried on that, the people in this issue spend enough time on criticals :) There is no reason to delay it on books, probably only a very small amount show the compact version anyway. Also lets not demote all UX changes to polish - unless we are adding a gloss effect :). Because this issue is similar to performance bugs that slow down Drupal, just in a different area.
Comment #22
Dries CreditAttribution: Dries commentedAlright, committed to CVS HEAD.