Drupal 10 readiness meeting / 26 April 2021 [#3206267]

Meeting will happen in #d10readiness on drupal.slack.com.

Hello and welcome to this Drupal 10 readiness meeting!

This meeting:
➤ Is for core and contributed project developers as well as people who have integrations and services related to core. Site developers who want to stay in the know to keep up-to-date for the easiest Drupal 10 upgrade of their sites are also welcome.
➤ Usually happens every other Monday at 18:00 UTC.
➤ Is done over chat.
➤ Happens in threads, which you can follow to be notified of new replies even if you don’t comment in the thread. You may also join the meeting later and participate asynchronously!
➤ Has a public agenda anyone can add to: `https://www.drupal.org/project/drupal/issues/3206267`
➤ *Transcript will be exported and posted* to the agenda issue. For anonymous comments, start with a :bust_in_silhouette: emoji. To take a comment or thread off the record, start with a :no_entry_sign: emoji.

0️⃣ Who is here today? Comment in the thread below to introduce yourself.

mglaman	:wave: Matt, Kenosha, WI – phpstan-drupal maintainer (edited)
Kristen Pol (she/her)	Kristen, Santa Cruz, CA
Chris Greatens	Chris, (cgreaten), Green Bay, WI
Neslee	Neslee, Goa
atul4drupal	Atul, India
longwave	Dave, UK
anmolgoyal74	Hi, anmol , india :flag-in:
hansa11	Hansa, India :wave:
shaal	Boca Raton, FL :sunglasses:(Umami, Drupal Rector):wave:
mansoor20	Hello, Mansoor :wave:
catch	Nat, joining after the fact.
gaurav mahlawat	Catching up, Gauravmahlawat :wave:
Kunal Kapoor	Hi, kunalkapoor from India
naresh_bavaskar	Hi, Naresh from India
Gábor Hojtsy (he/him)	Gábor Hojtsy late joiner in Hungary :)

1️⃣ Do you have suggested topics you are looking to discuss? Post in this thread and we'll open threads for them as appropriate.

Kristen Pol (she/her)	Feedback on how contribution went during DrupalCon
mglaman	drupal-rector – 0.10 upgrade
mglaman	Do we have any known dangerzones for 10 readiness? like jquery/javascript?
Kristen Pol (she/her)	Something we do in the bugsmash meeting is try to have something "non work related" so feel free to throw in something here... examples, what you are watching on TV or what you are reading for fun (edited)

3️⃣ drupal-rector – 0.10 upgrade status (from @mglaman)

mglaman	Thanks for reviewing, @Dan. I’ll be working on it again on Wed. I’m hoping we can get it merged so I can work on any follow ups for D9.Are all merge blockers outlined in the PR?
mglaman	I know part of it is is documenting how to run the tests
mglaman	cc @shaal if you’re online and maybe eyeballed
Dan	Thanks, @mglaman.I think the automated tests, Github Actions / Behat need to be reviewed. The Behat tests can likely be completely removed since they were replaced and the Github Actions jobs need to be consistent and we may be able to remove some of them if they are no longer needed.
Dan	I should have time at the end of the week to take a look. If I can run the automated tests and make sure Github Actions can run them, I think we will be in good shape.
mglaman	Okay, so the main thing is a good layer of polish across the board
mglaman	I’ll work on this during my Wed contribution time / live stream
mglaman	There’s going to be some autoloader bugs, which are shown in the PR with hacky fixes. I’ll be making a new package that drupal-rector and phpstan-drupal can share to leverage the workarounds. Otherwise I’m copying things to drupal-rector right now
Dan	I'm not concerned about it being polished, but the automated tests and Github actions have been helpful and I don't want to replace those partially.
mglaman	BUT that’s a post-merge thing
mglaman	AFAIK the actions are running the behat tests at full parity. It processes and runs diff
shaal	btw - latest Rector got fixed, and the issues we saw last week are now gone.
mglaman	I’ll follow up in the PR on Wed, thanks for the review @Dan
Dan	There is no behat run in this file: https://github.com/palantirnet/drupal-rector/blob/ad43a86c74d204bf220e16...
Dan	Which is fine since I think you made it part of PhpUnit.
mglaman	- run: diff -rubB rector_examples_updated ~/drupal/web/modules/custom/rector_examples
mglaman	that’s all Behat ran
mglaman	so now we do it manually
mglaman	it was causing failures before when we had bugs
Dan	Behat was also checking the YML file for parsing issues.
mglaman	that is in PHPUnit for deprecation-index
mglaman	but there’s no more YAML beyond that
Dan	You replaced these all, I'm fine with that, I think we just need to remove / replace the github actions.
mglaman	I think the action you linked is good to keep, running diff
mglaman	I think there is one which just executes without anything else, that could be dropped
Dan	Github Actions we found helpful:on main branch, checking packagist package, maybe this shouldn't be in the branch, but we didn't know where else to put itChecking the local copy to make sure the output matches as expectedChecking the index since other people use that
Dan	OK, we can just change the name to remove mentions of Behat and remove Behat itself.
Dan	The one by itself, I agree we can remove. It was one of the first tests we added to see if the thing ran at all. :)
mglaman	Yeah, I think that is all that is needed. We invoke the commands without Behat. Otherwise the existing tests persisted and we have additional/new PHPUnit coverage
Dan	Do you want me to give a shot at updating these actions and push against your branch?
Dan	Or wait for you to take a look later this week?
mglaman	@Dan go for it, more than welcome
mglaman	if you have time and want to, feel free
Dan	Cool. I can try now.
Dan	Github Actions can run PhpUnit at least. Not sure why I can't. :(
mglaman	I won’t have time until Wednesday. Which if you get it merge ready, then Wednesday I can hammer on D9
mglaman	For local: does it output the composer create-project error? because it is janky and silly, I’ll admit (edited)
mglaman	And, locally, one of the tests always fails but not on GitHub for the integration test. the Rector Rules tests are OK
Dan	I don't remember getting an error like that. If I try again I'll let you know.

4️⃣ Feedback on how contribution went during DrupalCon

Kristen Pol (she/her)	I'd love to hear what went well and where things could have been better
Kristen Pol (she/her)	I was very pleased with how my breakout room worked via BigBlueButton. Last year I found Open Social to be a distraction. This year I thought it was very helpful. Having a video option where others can do audio or just "lurk" was great. (edited)
shaal	I really enjoyed how it went this year. Having a room of people, that can communicate and discuss an issue while sharing their screen.
atul4drupal	Learning and experience from past year has helped this year event, which in many ways was better than the last time.
xjm	I think my one disappointment was that more people did not show up, but the fact that we were on Friday afternoon and evening at the end of a long week probably did not help. It seemed like the module upgrade part at least had a good number of participants, and Starterkit was also RTBCed as a result of the initiative day.
Kristen Pol (she/her)	Yeah... I think I had about 5 people in my breakout room... but that ended up being a good size for me to be able to try to include everyone... if there ended up being more, the rest would've probably been kind of left out (edited)
Gábor Hojtsy (he/him)	I don't think Drupal 10 had worse turnout actually for contribution then the rest of the week. @rachel_norfolk can possibly collate the list of contribution event signups (which were a pre-requisite to get to the BBB) to see how much overlap there was in the days in terms of participants.
xjm	Well, AutoUpdates alone had like 10 people, and then there were way more people than that who worked on BugSmash
xjm	So D10 seemed less attended by comparison with that at least
Gábor Hojtsy (he/him)	We had various rooms including people popping in to work on CKEditor, starterkit, even JS components.
Gábor Hojtsy (he/him)	I did not mean it as a measuring contest though, I don't have numbers. I did attend contribution on all days. And BBB participants seemed pretty level across the various days.
rachel_norfolk	Whilst it is a challenge to know exactly how each day was attended, here is a little record of who enrolled to each event:Monday First Time Contributor's Orientation 34Monday Mentor Orientation 14Tuesday Decoupled Menus - Reception 65Tuesday First Time Contributor's Orientation 21Wednesday Easy out of the box - Reception 68Thursday Autoupdates & Bug Smash - Reception 62Friday Drupal 10 readiness initiative - Reception 56Friday Decoupled Menus - Live Demos 18Friday General Contribution 11
rachel_norfolk	So, fairly even across the days, I’d say. I am also very interested in how things went with the afternoon contribution times. I have to try and separate my own desire for it to be “successful” from whether it objectively was - thats the trouble.
rachel_norfolk	I do think that, no matter how hard we try, coming along to a contribution event for the first time in a virtual environment is really intimidating. So, we certainly should beat ourselves up on numbers - but celebrate the successes we did have.
xjm	I had a number of people drop into my room, say nothing, and drop out. Basically one person showed up who was interested but couldn’t stay, and the channel got used as an autoupdates breakout room instead since no one else was there. I was also watching the real-time participant list of each breakdown on our day and most of the rooms only had the mentors/topic leads in them most of the time, with the exception of the module porting. (edited)
xjm	I was thinking virtual attendance would be less of a barrier for Han IRL since you don’t have to rebook your return flight and it was built into the event schedule, but I’m not sure that expectation panned out. It’d be interesting to compare attendance and behaviors to the Global Sprint Weekend, for example. (edited)
rachel_norfolk	Indeed. I would be intrigued to see if the experience of a “built in”, initiative-led contribution program would work differently at an in-person DrupalCon.
rachel_norfolk	But to do that, the most glaring thing we need first, are more mentors so we don’t over-burden the few
rachel_norfolk	Also worth noting I think a lot of attendees were also “doing their day job” as well as attending DrupalCon. That is a factor when people don’t need to leave home
Gábor Hojtsy (he/him)	And the family duties.

5️⃣ Do we have any known dangerzones for 10 readiness? like jquery/javascript? (from @mglaman)

mglaman	I’d like to know, as once I get drupal-rector onto 0.10 and d9 code supported, I’d like to focus on more d10 items
mglaman	@bnjmnm shared http://tinyurl.com/drupaljs with me
mglaman	but I wasn’t sure if that’s d10 blocker or not
longwave	I don't think there's anywhere near as many deprecations in D9 as there were in D8 mostly due to the much shorter release cycle
mglaman	agreed, it’s less about deprecations but more about 3rd party library work I assumed
longwave	There is a lot of work to do for CKEditor 5, ideally it needs to be experimentally ready soon so it can be stable for D10
longwave	We shouldn't have any issues shipping with Symfony 5 and we might even be able to ship with Symfony 6
longwave	If I remember correctly there are a few little issues around upgrading to Twig 3 but I haven't looked at that recently
mglaman	Do we have a like d10blocker tag or anything
mglaman	to tag critical things to work on?
longwave	Not sure there is a critical list yet but https://www.drupal.org/project/issues/search?issue_tags=Drupal%2010 covers a lot
Kristen Pol (she/her)	There are quite a few marked critical that are still open but I'm not sure how accurate this is: https://www.drupal.org/project/issues/search?projects=&project_issue_fol...…]n&priorities%5B%5D=400&issue_tags_op=%3D&issue_tags=Drupal+10 (edited)
Taran2L	CKE5 (imo) is the most complicated and risky one, as it's not only about us (the Drupal community), but also about the CKE team. They promise to deliver, but I think still things like arbitrary HTML is not possible (correct me if I'm wrong here)
lleber	I'm not seeing core feature parity between CKE4 and CKE5 in my experimentation. A fully fledged upgrade path will probably involve building some nontrivial (cke lingo) plugins.https://ckeditor.com/cke4/addon/stylescombo for example doesn't seem to have any cke5 equivalent. (edited)
xjm	CKEditor 5 is definitely the most at-risk, followed by the large patches for the removal of legacy jQuery dependencies like jQuery UI, Joyride, etc.
xjm	Blockers are descendants of #3118143: [meta] Release Drupal 10 on December 14... or 15... 2022
mglaman	yay, thanks @xjm! (edited)

6️⃣ Non-initiative-related for fun: Feel free to share an artist or some art you've been enjoying recently (musician, writer, movie, TV, anything)

mglaman	I’ve been enjoying failed 3D prints and considering posting them as abstract art, since I can’t get my Ender 3 to work :laughing:
lleber	Life in Color with David Attenborough is a family favorite.
Kristen Pol (she/her)	Found Beach Bunny fairly recently and have been enjoying the upbeat melancholy: https://www.beachbunnymusic.com/
Neslee	Got bit by a web spider :spider: and thought will become the next spiderman but didn't work, and then watched spiderman series and enjoyed
Kristen Pol (she/her)	Oh no! Hope you're okay!
sharique	Yeni Gelin/New Bride, it is very funny series.