Problem/Motivation

I'm opening this because it confuses me, I don't yet have evidence that it confuses anyone else.

admin/content has a list of node content, then tabs with lists of comments and files (in the 8.x standard profile).

admin/people has a list of user accounts, then tabs with roles and permissions.

There is admin/config/content - although the title is 'Content authoring' and the main sub-item is for text formats.

There is admin/config/people - by default the only sub-item is 'Account settings'.

Most of the 'settings' for content are under admin/structure, like 'Content types'.

I can never, ever remember where roles and permissions are when I need to find them, get it wrong every time.

Proposed resolution

Move roles and permissions to admin/structure, since they're primarily site-building tasks that are changed infrequently.

Remaining tasks

User interface changes

API changes

Data model changes

Comments

catch created an issue. See original summary.

dasjo’s picture

i agree.

sorry if this derails the discussion - happy to put this into a separate issue:

just if we consider content vs. configuration (entities), then we'd have

content: (nodes), comments, custom blocks, users, ...
structure: block types, content types, account fields (just a single one, as we don't have user types), ...

a few things from config (image styles, text formats) might also fall into the structure category

ifrik’s picture

I agree on the need to move permissions and roles.
It still confuses me as well after 9 years of site building....

  • People (or users) are the entities.
  • Permission and roles are configuration that relate to these entities, just as account settings so these should be grouped under "Configuration.

On the one hand, I can see the reason to treat them as other entities and add them with content, blocks, vocabularies - but they are somewhat different from these entities because users obviously have an active role. And if we want make Drupal easier to understand then we should keep users separate from the content they produce.

And additional problem is that there are two menu items called "People": as the list of users /admin/people and as a group in the configuration /admin/config/people. Could we rename that the later to "Users" and list account settings, permissions and roles there?

catch’s picture

Title: Move roles and permissions under admin/structure » Re-organise user/account items under admin/

@dasjo #2518960: Emphasize the most important items on the 'structure' page is a broader discussion of /structure. Overall I think it would be good to move towards /structure for config entities and /config for static configuration - at least as a general direction.

@clara to set up a content type I have to first create the content type + fields, but then set permissions for it in order for people to be able to create content (assuming a non-admin content-creation role exists). For me it makes sense for those related tasks to be in the same overall section of the admin interface.

catch’s picture

ifrik’s picture

Following a short IRC chat:

Structure for me is more the building blocks, and configuration the settings.

The user account fields, form and display are indeed something that site builders can expect under structure, where all other fieldable entities are. It's something that is often set up when a site is build, and then not changed much.

The settings on /admin/config/people/accounts on the other hand is more configuration than structure, and site admins are more likely to need to change these settings (for example to change the notification email address, or email text).

So, to make this issue more complex:

  • move the three field tabs as "user accounts" into structure
  • keep settings as "user registration" in Configuration (in a group "user" instead of "people")
  • move permissions and roles into configuration (or structure).
catch’s picture

Yes agreed with #6.

I still think permissions and roles are 'site building' tasks - probably they'd make more sense under admin/structure if we also moved other site building things there like text formats and image styles.

But definitely fields should be under structure, and actual settings settings should be under config.

yoroy’s picture

For context: during d7ux "People" got promoted to the toolbar mostly because people represent an important Drupal value, not necessarily because it represents such a primary group of tasks. I think user account settings got seperated out because more nitty gritty compared to roles/permissions, hence the double "People" links in admin.

I have no concrete thoughts about this yet, but I do recognize the "hunting for where permissions are again" sentiment :). Structure might well be the place. All the more reason to start exploring #2518960: Emphasize the most important items on the 'structure' page.

catch’s picture

I think it's fine for the listing of users to stay as a top-level toolbar item. Or at least this wouldn't be the issue to change that. Same as we have a top level link for content, and users aren't content.

It's the tabs that are definitely in the wrong place for me.

This might have to end up postponed on #2518960: Emphasize the most important items on the 'structure' page.

yoroy’s picture

Issue tags: +ux-hierarchy
jhodgdon’s picture

There are 3 issues that I think are all duplicates of each other:
- This one (relatively new)
- #715972: People section(s) are very confusing (from 2010)
- #1409940: Why does 'People' appear twice in the management menu? (from 2012).

Are they duplicates? If not, what is different? If so, let's close two of them.

#2617262: Add permissions and roles to administration menu is also related, and may also be a duplicate of this issue.

ifrik’s picture

Issue tags: +DevDaysMilan

Can we discuss this at DevDays in Milan to see how to proceed with these issues?

Version: 8.2.x-dev » 8.3.x-dev

Drupal 8.2.0-beta1 was released on August 3, 2016, which means new developments and disruptive changes should now be targeted against the 8.3.x-dev branch. For more information see the Drupal 8 minor version schedule and the Allowed changes during the Drupal 8 release cycle.

Version: 8.3.x-dev » 8.4.x-dev

Drupal 8.3.0-alpha1 will be released the week of January 30, 2017, which means new developments and disruptive changes should now be targeted against the 8.4.x-dev branch. For more information see the Drupal 8 minor version schedule and the Allowed changes during the Drupal 8 release cycle.

ifrik’s picture

Issue tags: +DevDays Seville

Since there is no further movement on this issue: Can we move Permissions and Roles to /admin/people?
That way at least we have all configuration about user accounts together.

DuaelFr’s picture

Fixing event tag :p

yoroy’s picture

Lets try this out and see if it works. Who wants to create a patch? Do we need to add a link to the configuration page from the user listing page?

ifrik’s picture

Status: Active » Needs review
FileSize
2.11 KB

Okay, here's a patch that simply moves the Permission and Roles pages to a different location at admin/config/people.

There are quite a few links to the permission pages (for example on help pages) but as long as the links are set correctly, they are still working. At least I couldn't find any that are broken.

yoroy’s picture

FileSize
35.06 KB
35.98 KB

Works!

And:

I do think we should add a line of help text on the people listing page that points to the configuration pages. Not sure whether to mention a single "People" section and link to admin/config or add individual links for both roles and permissions.

yoroy’s picture

Status: Needs review » Needs work
ifrik’s picture

Okay, a possible text on /admin/people could be something like.

For configuration of user accounts, permissions and roles check the <em>People Configuration</em> pages.

and linking it to /admin/config/people

ifrik’s picture

Status: Needs work » Needs review

I've added the text proposed it #21. Test fails still need fixing.

ifrik’s picture

Status: Needs review » Needs work

The last submitted patch, 23: 2695771-menu-permissions-roles-22.patch, failed testing.

ifrik’s picture

I've been trying to fix the failing test, but I'm not sure I got all of them.

ifrik’s picture

Status: Needs work » Needs review

Status: Needs review » Needs work

The last submitted patch, 25: 2695771-menu-permissions-roles-24.patch, failed testing.

pguillard’s picture

Assigned: Unassigned » pguillard

Fixing failing tests, at least some of them..

pguillard’s picture

Status: Needs work » Needs review
FileSize
8.46 KB
23.66 KB

Status: Needs review » Needs work

The last submitted patch, 29: 2695771-menu-permissions-roles-29.patch, failed testing.

pguillard’s picture

Assigned: pguillard » Unassigned
Status: Needs work » Needs review
FileSize
23.68 KB
493 bytes
10.98 KB
6.2 KB

Tabs were missing on the Permissions and Roles pages.

To be coherent, we should probably combine all tabs together in the Config >> People section ?

A the moment I let them separated :

tabs-permissions-roles

tabs_accounts

There should be no failing tests..

ifrik’s picture

pguillard,
thanks a lot for fixing those failing tests.
My intention was to have Permissions and Roles as two separate pages because they contain different functionality and have different permissions to access them.

Why did you decide to turn them into tabs?

pguillard’s picture

Sorry @Ifrik,
I did that as the tests were testing the presence of these tabs.

I removed these tabs and the corresponding tests, maybe somebody should check what I did on UserLocalTasksTest

ifrik’s picture

So I suppose the tests need to test the presence of the pages themselves instead of tabs on the People page then?

pguillard’s picture

I guess so.
So I added them in this patch.